Masters Alliance
9th Dan BlackBelt and Olympic Gold Medalist Herb Perez visit with the best and brightest to bring clarity to the future of Martial arts.
Masters Alliance
Building Black Belts and Future Leaders: Grandmaster Jack Corrie's Journey
Discover the remarkable journey of Grandmaster Jack Corrie, a martial arts legend with over 56 years of Taekwondo experience, as he transforms from a mischievous boy on an Air Force base to a Special Forces Marine and ultimately a revered instructor. Grandmaster Corrie shares pivotal moments from his life, including his mentors' influence and his passion for teaching that led him to produce thousands of black belts and run a successful school for over four decades. Gain insights into his unwavering commitment to consistency and dedication, which have been key drivers of his long-term success in both martial arts and life.
Our episode also delves into the prestigious global leadership roles within the Kukkiwon Korean Taekwondo Moo do kwon, highlighting the responsibilities and impacts of these positions. We examine the dual nature of Taekwondo, contrasting its sports side under the World Taekwondo (WT) with its martial arts essence under the Kukkiwon. The critical role of martial arts instructors in shaping well-rounded individuals and future leaders is emphasized, alongside the significance of traditional values, mentorship, and fostering a respectful community through the Mudo Taekwondo Association. Discover how these principles aim to build tomorrow's leaders through a collective commitment to excellence.
Finally, be inspired by the stories of success and legacy within Taekwondo, featuring accomplished instructors like Master Porian and Grandmaster Jack Corrie. Learn about the factors behind their achievements, from rigorous training and strong educational backgrounds to dedication and smart training. Reflect on the valuable life lessons imparted by Taekwondo, such as humility and continuous self-improvement. This episode offers a wealth of knowledge for both seasoned martial artists and newcomers, showcasing Taekwondo's profound impact on personal growth and community building.
Welcome to the Masters Alliance podcast Uncut. I am Herb Perez. Today we are joined by an inspirational individual who has achieved much in every area of the martial arts competition, business, role modeling and facing forward to the future to lead us with other organizations. Grandmaster Jack Corey is an inspirational individual and you're going to hear in this podcast his early stories about how he started, his reasons for continuing and his vision for the future and his organization, mudo Taekwondo Strap in. This is going to be a great podcast. Welcome to the Masters Alliance podcast. I'm Herb Perez and today I'm joined by one of my favorite people to speak to, not just for any reason, but certainly for a number of reasons favorite people to speak to, not just for any reason, but certainly for a number of reasons. He's Grandmaster Jack Corey and we're going to get into his background but, more importantly, the success and passion he has for the martial arts today. How are you, Grandmaster?
GM Jack Corrie:I'm doing excellent, thank you. It's a pleasure speaking with you today.
Herb Perez:Well, I couldn't have thought of anyone better to speak to on this day or any day for that matter because of your legacy and the things that you've been able to do for so many people that you do quietly. But I want to start with your journey to mastery. Your Taekwondo journey is remarkable. Can you share some of your early experiences in Taekwondo and what inspired you to dedicate your life to this martial art? You to dedicate your life to this martial art.
GM Jack Corrie:So I've been in Taekwondo for about 56 years, so it's been quite a journey. Sometimes it's hard to remember the beginning, but back in time I started Taekwondo because I was a young boy. My dad was in the Air Force and we were running around the base causing all kinds of havoc and my dad decided I needed to do something. So he took me to the base gym and they just happened to have a taekwondo instructor there and put me in class. So I started doing taekwondo there. And then of course he got transferred down to Sacramento area where I popped into Grandmaster Kong School briefly and it was too far to drive downtown so he put me in a Tung Sudo school with a gentleman by the name of Andy Apo.
GM Jack Corrie:So I trained with Andy Apo during my high school days and then went into the military. You know my military background. I was a special forces guy with Marine Corps, recon, which of course lots of hand-to-hand combat stuff. But I also met a gentleman named Kenyon who was a Tung Sudo instructor down in the Oceanside area. I trained with him while I was in the Marine Corps, came back to the Sacramento area, popped into Tung Sudo school. I met a gentleman by the name of Jack Pierce to Tuxedo School. I met a gentleman by the name of Jack Pierce and Grandmaster Pierce who's since passed on, bless his heart was a great instructor.
GM Jack Corrie:I worked out with him but he was into lots and lots of tournament competitions and back in those days, the tournaments you know you probably remember they were point fighting, but it was. You could sweep somebody, you could take them to the ground, you could kick them in the groin, you could punch them in the face. We fought three, two minute rounds. So it was very similar to like, almost like a UFC fight today and you got in there and if you knocked the guy out you won. And you just went in there and pounded it out and for some reason, with that Marine Corps background and all my training, I kind of enjoyed that.
GM Jack Corrie:So it got good to me and I enjoyed fighting like that. And so it also allowed me to get rid of some of my frustrations, because in my early days I went to work in the prison system as a correctional officer and sergeant lieutenant Ended up leaving Folsom Prison as an associate warden. But it allowed me to get rid of a lot of my frustrations in the ring back then, and so that was my journey and for some reason I just stuck with it. I never gave up. I enjoyed teaching. I opened up my Taekwondo school about 40 years ago, in 1983, 41 years, 41 years and it's kept me going ever since. Just the feeling of teaching and contributing and grooming and growing people. I enjoyed it and that's what kept me going all these years.
Herb Perez:Well, that's amazing. And that leads me to my next question. Because of your early start and your passion for your community, I've heard from a friend of ours that you have hundreds of black belts. How many black belts have you turned out over your years?
GM Jack Corrie:Oh my God, 40 years is a long time. It's literally thousands. For some reason I've had the ability to retain students. At one point I was in the American Taekwondo Association and I had the highest retention in the entire ATA, and so that's. I think that says something. So the numbers of black belts are in the thousands. I have probably 30 masters. I have students that have achieved all the way up into the eighth degree black belt level who are out running highly successful schools. You know Master Peririan being one of them. That you know runs a very successful school. Today I think I have about 200 and maybe close to 230 black belts, and I've got another 60 going for testing in October. So it's going to push me up around 300.
Herb Perez:Wow, and you've just celebrated your 40th anniversary of running a commercial martial arts school. Not many people can say that. What do you think has led to such an amazing accomplishment?
GM Jack Corrie:You're making me feel old because I remember you back in the early nineties when we'd bring you up and have you help us with seminars and teaching our people, olympic training, and you know you did some wonderful things for us back then. 40 years has been a journey, you know. I think you know sometimes I use the word that's not a real word stick-to-itiveness, never giving up and being able to kind of what I believe being consistent. You know, flashes of brilliance come and go, consistency and delivering a high quality program and focusing on the students and truly teaching the art. You're going to come up with some great fighters yes, everybody gets those but it's really the ones that are not the great fighters that need you the most if you're really teaching the art and believing in that is what has allowed me to keep going, thinking that. You know, my overarching goal was to develop strong, independent human beings who could go out into society and be contributing members to our society and teaching them how to do that, giving them the ethical foundation, good decision-making skills and helping them, one student at a time, change the world and that's what's kept me going and for 40 years it's been quite a journey.
GM Jack Corrie:Next year I'll be 70 years old. I don't like to say that, but I look back and it's like, wow, where did the time go and how did I keep that business running that long? I had that talk yesterday with one of my school owners who's had a school for about six or seven years and I said the next piece is now. You've grown a successful school, you're making good money, you're doing the right things, you're teaching the art, and the art comes first and the money comes second. But now you're going to have to figure out how to sustain that inside your community and have your school become part of that community, because that's what's going to keep the school growing and and keep people bringing their, their children, to you. I look at my school sometimes and I have generations and generations of members. I have great grandchildren training today of people that trained with me back in the day, and if you're teaching from your heart, that people will know that.
Herb Perez:Why do you think that so many other schools struggle with black belt retention?
GM Jack Corrie:So black belt is kind. You know I teach an instructor's course and part of the course is actually teaching the. You know how to be positive and cycle management and all of that, and it's mostly wrapped around color belts, right, and the eight week cycle and basic. You know the different themes of the weeks and all that. And and then then you come to the part where the schools grow up to the point to where they've got black bulbs and they don't know how to retain them right. And so the next piece of teaching is how do you teach instructors how to teach black balls? Well, part of it is, when I look at some of the instructors, that some of them are homegrown, so I've had my hands on them all the way. So I trained them to be a second degree. They know what they needed to know to be a second degree, third degree, fourth degree, fifth degree, sixth degree, seventh degree and now even eight degrees on training.
GM Jack Corrie:And so what curriculum do you use? Do you have a curriculum? Do you break it down? Do you have midterms? Do you have actually skills and knowledge beyond your Taekwondo that you're giving? Do you have extracurricular activities such as judo, jujitsu, mma, different kinds of themes that you could use quarterly or monthly, that you could deliver to those students in that class. Besides just the taekwondo forms they need to know to test to the next level, part of it is actually having that curriculum and being able to deliver it and keep them excited.
GM Jack Corrie:And you know I always tell people my taekwondo students, my black belt classes, they fight every night, they gear down, we turn on the music and they just have a blast. They have fun, they build camaraderie. But it's also balanced off with having a curriculum to deliver to them. But it's more than just the physical curriculum. It's how do you groom somebody to be a fourth degree? Or how do you groom somebody to be a master? What do they need to know to be a master in the taekwondo world and function and be somebody that other students can, that your other black belts can look up to and exemplify and want to be like.
GM Jack Corrie:And you know we've talked about I think I've talked with you about some of this. You know it's a taekwondo school in and of itself almost, you know, becomes a cult-like environment. You have to be careful with that. You need to have your students have the ability to go expand their experiences like we did when we were growing up. We had tournament circuits out there that we could go to and compete in and somebody was out there working running those circuits, providing that environment where we gained those experiences that caused us to grow beyond the four walls of the Taekwondo school. Well, providing black belts, that access to something bigger than this inside the school, is a big part of retention believe it or not a huge part of retention.
GM Jack Corrie:You know we, I look at the different organizations that are out there and you know one of those I use is the ATA. You go to an ATA event and you see 12,000 black belts and it just blows your mind, how do they get 12,000 black belts competing in 87, 88 rings for a week? I mean. So that talks about the retention piece. They have to have that exposure to an environment where they can grow outside your school, and maybe even three, because you could have a B circuit in that first layer and then take them out to USAT or other events when you've got the real talented fighters. That's kind of the magic and what helps you with retention of black belts giving them a purpose, making their training purpose-driven.
Herb Perez:So it's going to lead me into my next question, because I have a series of questions that I think are important for us to discuss. But global leadership you hold prestigious positions in the Kukyuan Korean Taekwondo Mudokwon. What are the key responsibilities of this role and how do they impact the global Taekwondo community?
GM Jack Corrie:the global taekwondo community. You know you have the same responsibilities and obligations as a gold medalist out there. I mean, you're somebody that all of us, including myself, look up to, admire, respect and being that leader and being that person, we have to make sure that we're injecting the right philosophy into what we're saying and what we're contributing to in the taekwondo world, whether it's the sports side or the martial arts side. I like to look at the WT kind of has the sports side of the game and the Kukiwon, if you will, has the art side of the game, and so you get to decide which side of that do you want to play in and how do you want to contribute to that. So for me, I prefer to be viewed as a martial artist and I believe that as a martial artist and being a senior member of the martial arts community in the Taekwondo world and working with the Kukiwanas on their technical advisory board and providing them technical advice on policies and procedures and practices and where they're going, what's the strategic direction of the organization, I have the ability to contribute. My views, which I've shared just a few minutes ago, is that you know, we as martial arts instructors have an obligation to create the future. You know, all teachers teach for prosperity, for the next generation to be better than we are and to be able to cause the Kukyuan to stay focused on delivering the tools that the masters need to be able to be successful at doing that building strong, independent students. Not everybody's going to be an Olympic champion like you are, sir. Some of them are going to just need to be a better person and be able to be mentored and learn how to be a better person in society and be successful, and they end up being doctors and lawyers and other things. And so, if we can do that, that's the art side, because the product of the art, you know, isn't a pot or a canvas, it's a person, it's a human being that you're trying to build into a strong person. And so being in a position of authority and being allowed to put that you know that into practice or drive it through the organization down to the master's, I think is important and keeping our eye on that ball. That as a martial art, yeah, there's a combat side, but there's also that art side and we have the ability to change a lot of lives.
GM Jack Corrie:I have lots and lots of students. I was watching TV this morning and up on the screen comes this law firm that you know, that, that and and they're right in front of me as one of my little students you know Chucky Carraway. There he is now. He's a big lawyer in town and got it, got his own commercials on channel 31. And you know, and it's, it's. It makes you feel good, you know, cause those are our successes, that's. I feel more successful when I see that than I think about the gold medals that I won when I was fighting. It makes me feel good.
GM Jack Corrie:We're going to talk a little bit about that. 1965, when Taekwondo was, the Kwans were forced to come together under KTA and eventually in the 70s, you know, there was another push to drive Mudokon back into the Kukiwon which caused the change of the forms. A lot of people don't know that right. I mean, the forms went from you know to the current Taegooks because of the Mudokon coming in and so being in a position there to actually do the same thing that I'm doing with the Kukiwon is drive traditional values back into Taekwondo and get the training delivered out to the instructors on. You know, let's remember our role. We can change the world one student at a time, and I enjoy that.
Herb Perez:And that leads me to my next question about the Mudo Taekwondo Association. As president of your own organization, what are the core values and what sets it apart from other organizations?
GM Jack Corrie:So I think it's exactly that which I was just talking about, only it goes a little bit deeper.
GM Jack Corrie:Move in that direction that you're moving in terms of having that martial arts environment where there's lots of respect, lots of discipline and living by the oath and tenets of Taekwondo and having all those like-minded people coming together to provide an environment for their students to grow, because that's really what Mudo does.
GM Jack Corrie:It's that second layer of the business model beyond the Taekwondo school that provides that environment for students to go and grow and come back to the school and for all of us to work to build the pool of knowledge that exists inside of each one of our schools. We go out, we learn something, we come back and we dump something back into the pool of knowledge and that school just continues to prosper and grow, whether it be business or be the martial arts side of it. And that's what Mudo is about is attracting just high-quality people who have the same mindset, who want to change the world one student at a time want to change the world, one student at a time. We really want to learn how to be successful in their business, but also, more importantly, focus on the students. For me, it's all about the students being there for them, grooming them, growing them and creating tomorrow's leaders, because they're going to pop up out of those environments.
Herb Perez:Well, so many of your schools in your MUDO organization are running very successful operations, and one you mentioned before was Master Porian, and she does incredible numbers and has incredible retention as well, and I visited her facility so I saw it firsthand. What do you think about being part of an organization contributed to that?
GM Jack Corrie:What do I think about being part of an organization contributed to that. What do I think about being part of an organization? Well, what do you think?
Herb Perez:about her being part of your organization and how did that contribute to that her success?
GM Jack Corrie:Well, you know she has a strong background. You know she's got a master's degree from Stanford. So she's got good, strong ethics and values. She trained with you back in the day. You helped her with her taekwondo journey. She made it to the U S team and and showed clearly she has that competitive side of her and that spirit and skill and knowledge to be able to be successful martial artist. But on the business side she's also got that education and that background and and and an internal drive that a lot of people maybe don't have. I mean, we could all be more successful if we work 12-hour days. We don't all work 12-hour days like she does, but at the same time her being part of the organization brings you know, she brings a lot to the table because she's also somebody that the juniors who have actually grew up with her trained in the school with her. She came out of my school as a young teenager and so all the rest of the folks in the organization who actually came from my school grew up with her, trained with her, and look at her as somebody. She's the mentor to them. She's that next generation.
GM Jack Corrie:You know her job as an eighth degree typically is facing down and running the organization and instilling those values, core values, into all the instructors and making sure they're doing the things. I had that job when I was an eighth degree to face down in the organization. My job today, as a ninth degree, as you you know, working with KTA, working with the Kukiwan is to face out of the organization and provide an environment where the organization can stay connected and still be and be successful and provide an environment where students if we do have those A players they can pop out and we have the political clout to help and assist them outside of the Mudo group to help and assist them outside of the MUDO group, and that's a championship mindset and I'm going to talk a little bit about that.
Herb Perez:And you've reflected in your comments certainly some Aristotelian and Platonic ideals on how we should do service, and I think you're absolutely correct, but we haven't spoken about your championship mindset. You had achieved incredible success as a competitor, and what are the mental and physical strategies that contributed to those numerous championships and victories?
GM Jack Corrie:You know it's hard work. You know that it's a lot of hard work and it's a lot of dedication, a lot of devotion to getting yourself physically fit and so that you're able and capable and working on your you know, on on your skill sets and and, and a lot of it comes from a couple of different things. One is you have to have a mindset and a philosophy. My mindset and philosophy around competition is sweat plus sacrifice equals success. You got to do the work. You got to make a lot of sacrifices and and if you do, you can be successful. You also got to do the work. You got to make a lot of sacrifices and if you do, you can be successful. You also got to be real smart about that right. Smart fighters win more consistent than talented fighters. So gaining the knowledge and the skills requires you to have training partners. You've got to have some training partners who are willing to work with you and push you beyond where you, when you want to quit, they keep pushing, and I had that.
GM Jack Corrie:I was fortunate and lucky to have folks like James Pickett and Wade Vieira and Steve Sims and some of the folks up here that you know that were my partners. Michael AJ, who was on the first US team that fought representing the United States and Korea in 1973, first world championships. He's part of our group. Those guys pushed me and pushed me. They'd come and pick me up on Sunday mornings and drag me into the school and we would fight for hours and hours. They'd beat the snot out of me sometimes because I'd be tired, but they would never let you give up to the point to where, when it came time to fight, fighting was easy, because when you got in the ring, you saw everything before it ever came at you and you were responding. And you trained so hard that your responses were subconscious and not conscious thought. And that's a spot that, when you get to that place and when you're fighting, it's hard for people to even touch you.
Herb Perez:I think those are great words. I think that great fighters come from great environments and great gyms, where people in those gyms and those Taekwondo schools and dojongs push them so that when they do enter the arena and I was certainly fortunate to be in the New York area with guys like that I wasn't afraid of anyone because I fought the smartest and the fastest and the strongest. So it was actually easier once I got into a tournament because I only had to worry about one guy at one time. It was certainly different. Well for you, sir, the Hall of Fame induction. What does it mean for you to be inducted into the official Taekwondo Hall of Fame and receive the Taekwondo Ambassador's Award from the US Grandmaster Society?
GM Jack Corrie:You know I'm humbled by all of that, just to have my name inducted into the Taekwondo Hall of Fame. I know you're in there and there's people like you that are in there and I'm very humbled by that. You know I tend to be a humble person by nature. I'm very humble that people consider me as a contributor to the taekwondo. Overall I've given a lot.
GM Jack Corrie:You know, I like to tell my masters and I think of myself as this, and it was told to me a long time ago by Hang-On Lee that you know an instructor is like a candle and that candle, the light from the candle, provides people. You know, the ability to see where they're going, provides them the warmth and the comfort while they're on their journey in life. But at the same time the candle shrinks as it gives of itself. And I feel like I've given a lot of myself over these last 50 years to Taekwondo and made lots and lots of personal sacrifices. And I still do, and I know you do. We travel a lot. I'm traveling all the time. I'm doing seminars and I'm out there helping people.
GM Jack Corrie:And you know I could be in Hawaii, I could be in Europe, I could be doing lots of other things, but you know giving of myself and being recognized for giving of yourself. You know giving of myself and being recognized for giving of yourself. I feel good and I'm humbled and to be a part of this esteemed organization, the Taekwondo Hall of Fame, and also the Ambassador Award from the US Taekwondo Grand Master Society. That's your peers saying hey, we want to recognize you for what you're out there doing, and that feels good and at the same time it starts making you go now wait a minute. You know I I used to be young and now they're giving me these awards that are Hall of Fame things. Is my journey finished or am I getting near the end? Makes you start thinking that way.
Herb Perez:Well, you're a torchbearer for sure, and I think that you know you're, you're, we're all getting closer to that place where we need to be, like you said, facing outwards, and I think you do a great job. But it leads me into the next question, which is mentorship and legacy. I mean as a level one, kuki one, master examiner and Hamadang judge, how do you approach mentoring, the next generation of Taekwondo practitioners and leaders?
GM Jack Corrie:So so you know the level one stuff, that that that's all about going and continuing your education and continuing to learn and never thinking you know everything, because there's so much more to learn. You know when I go to those courses every time and sometimes I go to the courses many times I've even been called upon to teach those courses. I've taught the examiner's course, I've taught the entire course, the master's course for the Kukiwan, and you learn every time you go. Do that and you learn not only from all the book work but just the 300 masters that show up, that are in the room with you and talking to them and training with them and working with them and gaining friendships and continuing to grow. But I think if you're going to be a mentor and if you're going to function at a certain level as ninth degree black belts, I think we have an obligation to continue to learn and grow so that we have what we need to pass down to people below us. And so I've always believed in doing that. When I was a fifth degree, I had to share with my fourth degrees what they needed to do to be a good fourth degree. When I was a sixth degree, what I learned as a fifth degree. I had to give to my fifth degrees and so as a ninth degree now I'm doing that with my eighth degrees. I'm teaching them how to run organizations, how to create environments where the students can blossom and be successful, and I think we have to do that and that mentoring and grooming and growing that next generation, we all should be doing that.
GM Jack Corrie:You know, rank, responsibility and authority in my mind go hand in hand. And when you take the rank in the Marine Corps, when I was in the Marine Corps, I learned that when you take that rank to be, if you want to be a sergeant or a gunnery sergeant, whatever that next rank is, you better be willing to step out and fulfill the role and do the things that that person does. You don't just take the rank and sit there for six, seven, eight or even nine years between eighth and ninth degree and do nothing. You've got to go do something. I ask my instructors all the time when they come up for rank I'm a sixth degree and I want to be a seventh degree, excellent.
GM Jack Corrie:During the last six years, what have you done, not during the last six years, but year by year? Six, make you know year one year, two years, three years, four years, five? What did you do to grow? You know? Did you go to the cookie one course and get your level two? Did you go to? You know? Have you gone to seminars? Did you go to the seminar when grandmaster Perez was here sharing his knowledge, on, on, on on on taekwondo sparring? Did you go to the seminar when Paul Wolfman was teaching poomsae, because he's one of the few folks that have had his people win a lot of poomsae gold medals in world competitions? What have you actually done that caused you to grow?
GM Jack Corrie:Time doesn't make you grow, it's what you do during that time. And so putting that kind of stuff in place for your juniors causes them to mature at the ranks that they're supposed to be and ready for the rank they're asking to go to. But they also know that at that new rank, you don't just get that rank and sit there. You're going to get assigned some more responsibilities by me. I'm going to hold you accountable to do more things than you did when you were that rank lower.
GM Jack Corrie:And so I believe that's what we're supposed to be doing is grooming that next generation, making sure that they're continuing their education and growing like professionals do, whether a lawyer, a doctor, whatever.
GM Jack Corrie:You've got continuing education you've got to follow, and for me it's good to see the Kuki one doing that with their level three, level two, level one courses, because that expands our knowledge base so that when we're out here functioning in society we do a better job. An example for me was when I went to the examiner's course the first time I went back to my school, because I saw things differently now, at a much more decomposed level, that when I went back to my school I was like, oh my God, my students don't look as good as I thought they should look. Students don't look as good as I thought they should look. Because now I have learned some things that I can go back to my school and jacked into that pool of knowledge that exists in my school by training my instructors to see the things that I learned, to see that I didn't see before, and so that's the kind of stuff that I think is important for us.
Herb Perez:Those are great words. I mean I remember my first test for my group when I moved to California after living in New York and really only training competitors, and I came here and started to open a school that was inclusive for everyone and I came home after my first test and just cried because I was like man, my guys are terrible. I'm terrible at teaching, but that's changed obviously over the years. I realized they weren't terrible. I'm terrible at teaching, but that's changed obviously over the years. I realized they weren't terrible. They were just in a growth stage. But I mean I want to talk a little bit about the future of taekwondo. What are the biggest challenges and opportunities facing taekwondo today, both in the United States and globally, and what are your hopes for the future of this martial art?
GM Jack Corrie:States and globally, and what are your hopes for the future of this martial art? Wow, that's a big question, you know. So some of the biggest challenges, I think. Taekwondo, you know clearly there's two sides to the game today. There's the sports side and then there's the martial arts side and I think the kuki ones try and really hard to fulfill their role and do a really good job. And in and working on by the way, mudo means traditional right, working on the mudo side of taekwondo and as an art, and trying to provide the instructors what they need to know to be better martial artists and to be actually really truly be.
GM Jack Corrie:Sabu nims out there, you know, like the father figure, if you will, versus the coach on the WT side. And on the WT side I see them struggling to try to. I don't know. It's almost like they're trying to do what the politicians do they're looking at the polls and molding themselves and their philosophies and everything. They just keep moving all over the place trying to attract more spectatorship so that they can stay in the Olympics, versus focused on trying to get back to where this is supposed to be a fight. You know you're not supposed to be out there doing chicken kicking and coming up all these weird kicks to touch somebody's helmet so you can get a point. I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's. That is almost disastrous to the other side. We're over on the other side. On the art side, we're trying to train people to be you know to, to win in life, not win in a little game that the rules keep changing and molding, and honestly, for me that's disturbing and that's the biggest challenge in Taekwondo today is, sometimes I don't even want to be associated with that because I really want to focus on the art, because 99% of my students are going to be martial artists, not gold medalists, right, in fact, 99.9%, probably, right, it's a very small number. And so if I want to make a difference in the world and if I want to fulfill what I believe my obligation is to the art of taekwondo, I have to keep my focus here and work with the kuki one and the folks are working on the, the dough side, right on this other side.
GM Jack Corrie:I, I, I love the fighting. I, in the early days, you remember, I was heavily involved in the UFC. I did jiu-jitsu and I did all that stuff. I trained fighters that fought in the UFC at the highest levels and won all kinds of championships, because I enjoy that fight, part of it but they almost have done the same thing too the weight classes, the rules. It gets softer and changing, morphing for entertainment, and I see taekwondo morphing for entertainment. I don't like that.
GM Jack Corrie:And so the biggest struggle, I think, for taekwondo is to get WT back on some type of a track to where it looks like they're fighting right. You know, and and you know you go back to the days when we punched in the face. It was a very different fight. It was a fight you had to get in there. It was pugilistic. You could, you know you had to get in there and bang. Today I'm not quite sure they're doing that. And even from the early days of my UFC, where there was no time limits and there was no weight classes, you went into the ring and you fought. And today I watch them and it's all about strategy and trying to survive the rounds. And I look at the WT side and it's all about strategy and how to survive the rounds and score these weird looking points and it's like, ah, it's just, it bothers me, and so I think that's one of the biggest struggles. How do you fix that. I don't know the answer to that. You know, I think it's going to take some leadership change and and some lessons learned, you know, from that. You know they're going to hurt taekwondo because of that, and I think that side actually hurts the traditional side right now.
GM Jack Corrie:In the beginning, I did not, you were there, it didn't hurt, right, it was. They were good, hard, fight, fought, fights, and people respected it and and it caused us on the taekwondo side to to work hard to try to develop people. I mean, we even I sent a group of people down to you, right, we had a whole group of people Roseboro and Prairian and you know, david Tsuji, and there's a whole group of them that we were like, yeah, let's, let's, let's do this, let's support all of this. So that's, that's the challenge that we face, you know. And the other thing is, because of that, now all of a sudden you got MMA schools all over the place competing with Taekwondo schools down the road. We didn't have that, we weren't worried about that, but today, now we are right, because I think there's more MMA schools, if you look at the big reports, than there are Taekwondo schools.
Herb Perez:So that's an existential crisis for sure, and I joke and I'm very opinionated, which I try not. We're going to have another. I'll invite you back, for we're going to invite you back for another conversation with a good group of my friends and friends of yours to have the bigger conversation. I'll leave you one last joke before I get to my next question, which is the only thing that happens in a Taekwondo match now is people's feelings get hurt. Nobody actually gets hurt. But on a personal philosophy, what life lessons have you learned through taekwondo that are applicable to everyone, regardless of whether or not they practice martial arts?
GM Jack Corrie:Life lessons. I've learned a lot of life lessons through my journey. I really have, and it's a process of trying to make yourself a better person each year, be better than you were the year before and do more, give more. And I've learned to be more humble. I've learned that humility is very important in life. I've learned probably one of the biggest lessons is that consistency is the key to success. You know you have to be consistent in what you're doing in life to end up successful at the end of your life. And so I look back across that journey, as you've walked me through it here just now, and I look at it and I go how did I end up where I'm at today? And that's because I never gave up.
GM Jack Corrie:And if I can teach my students today to never give up, right, they can be successful at anything they want to do or be in life. They want to be a doctor, a lawyer, a dentist, whatever they think is the esteemed thing. They want to be even an Olympic gold medalist. It's possible. I mean, I look at you. It's possible. Anybody can get there if they never give up and they keep trying. It might take you 20 years to be a doctor. If you're not, don't have the same IQ as somebody else, but you could be a doctor, right? And so I try to teach my students that, and that's something that I've learned. That not giving up has caused me to be sitting here as a ninth degree today that I never imagined in my wildest dreams when I was out there fighting and doing what I'm doing, and I'm sure you feel the same way. And now we have this obligation and this huge yoke of responsibility around our neck to try to help guide Taekwondo to where it needs to be for the next generation and those are great words.
Herb Perez:I have one last question, and this is new I haven't done it with taekwondo to where it needs to be for the next generation. And those are great words. I have one last question, and this is new I haven't done it with any of the other people that I've interviewed and you're going to be my first, and then I'm going to expand this because I kind of like it and, to be honest, I got this question from AI and it says is there a fun fact or surprising talent that you possess outside of taekwondo that your students or colleagues might not know about and would be surprised to find out?
Herb Perez:You know I don't talk about it and I ask you not to talk about it, but yeah, we won't talk about it and you don't have to say it, because if we do talk about it, here it's going to end up in a podcast.
GM Jack Corrie:Some people know I was very successful and very accomplished as a businessman in a technology world, winning things like. I actually won the Laureate Award as a technologist for my contributions and inventions during the technology evolution of technology, and so the Laureate Award is probably the most esteemed thing that you can get. I think at the time, the committee members were like Bill Gates and Jobs and Mary Ellison and just the highest level of people Jobs and Mary Ellison and just the highest level of people.
Herb Perez:And in fact I got it right there in your city of San Francisco, with Willie Brown being the representative from the government with standing with me to receive that award. So it's a long time ago, but but I you know I try not to do something and you're still showing us the way to do the thing that we should all be doing better. And I couldn't agree with you more. When we get in those rooms with the 300 or more masters taking that course, the inspiring part of it is them themselves at your organization. And I was proud and honored to be honored by you and for you to elevate me to a ninth on in the Mudo organization and then to accept my schools both of my schools as members. So I'm looking forward to that growth process because I love to learn and I couldn't think of anyone better to have as a mentor than you and your group and your organization. So I hope I can earn the trust that you've given and accepted me as a member.
Herb Perez:But I don't want to take too much more of your time today. I just want to thank you for taking the time to serve as a role model and to be facing outward in the places where we need you most, and that's the interaction between you and all these organizations that hold a tremendous amount of respect for you and give you a seat at the table so that you can continue to advocate for what Taekwondo is as a martial art, and I could think of no one better to do that, especially in light of all the different ways that you've participated in it. So, on behalf of the Masters Podcast Alliance, Uncut, I want to thank you personally for today.
GM Jack Corrie:I'm humbled that you say that and thank you, and I'm so blessed to have you as a friend through all these years and I respect you immensely and you know, I know you're going to help me a lot too. Thank you, sir.
Herb Perez:Well, that was Grandmaster Jack Curry, and what a tremendous amount of information and takeaways. So when I do these podcasts, I'm always trying to take away something that I can use in my own life or with my students, and I can think of three or four or five things that he said that I'm going to use today. I encourage you to reach out and learn more about the Mudo Taekwondo Association and Grandmaster Jack Curry, but, more importantly, check out some more of our Masters Alliance podcast uncut, for more individuals like Grandmaster Curry who share their knowledge and their passion for what you can do, what you can be and what you can inspire others to be. This has been a Masters Alliance podcast on Cut, and I am Herb Perez, see you.